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New Post 2/7/2012 6:06 AM
User is offline Tony Markos
493 posts
5th Level Poster


Re: Wikipedia needs your help 

Kimbo and Chris:

I agree with Kimbo that artificial requirements buckets waste time.  Data flow diagramers call such "buckets" a forced, artificial partitioning (i.e., a forced, artiticial division of requirements).   This is a huge issue.  The classic dictionary definition of analysis (Kimbo, I know you have heard me say this before, but for others, let me repeat) is:  "Analysis:  Partitioning an entity [such as a system] into components, and then determining how the parts interrelate."  Because business systems can not be seen of felt (only the mechanisms used to implement them can), partitioning of them is especially difficult.  Therefore, the biggest part of business analysis - analysis, not analysis support - is partitioning.

I do not think the BABOK even mentions partitioning, and has little to say about decomposition.   If you take in whole that the BABOK does not talk about partitioning - but it goes even further, reinforces wastefull behavior in steering Business Analysis to define their very job via a forced, artificial partitioning, it should come as no supprise that much immaturity within the BA community exists.

Tony

 
New Post 2/7/2012 6:57 AM
User is offline Sandy
74 posts
8th Level Poster




Re: Wikipedia needs your help 

If the meaning and intent of the BABOK definitions was to define 3 different abstraction levels for one type of requirement, then I would agree with Tony and Kimbo that this would be unnecessary overhead.  However, the BABOK classification is intended to differentiate between 3 distinct and different types of requirements.  There is no hierarchical or linear or sequential relationship between the 3 classes.

Contrary to Tony's statement, the BABOK actually does suggest decomposition as an analysis technique for all 3 classes.  However, decomposition for each class would start at a different place and produce quite different results.  Perhaps if I go back to my 'fruit' analogy as an example, that might help.  If you think of an orange as a 'system', then you might decompose solution requirements for an orange into peel, pulp, segments, and seeds.  Stakeholder requirements, however, would be akin to cross-segments cuts across the orange.  You could not decompose any single cross-segment into the same peel / pulp / segments / seeds of the orange system.  Stakeholder requirements are not intended to represent a high-level view of the orange.  Stakeholder requirements are valuable for certain purposes - to assess the needs of stakeholders, to identify the impacts of system changes on given stakeholder organizations, and to trace requirements back to stakeholders (for communications purposes, engagement purposes, etc.) as examples.

The BABOK does not recommend or even suggest that requirements should be defined across all 3 classifications for any given system or solution, and I do not believe that any participants in this discussion would recommend that either.  The class of requirement to be defined is the choice of an informed BA, as appropriate for any given project or set of work.  BA's who focus on software projects might only and always use the solution requirements class.  Each class has a different purpose, different modeling techniques, etc.  An enterprise model cannot be represented by a context diagram or modeled through information flow / data flow diagrams - but these techniques work very well for solution requirements.

 
New Post 2/7/2012 7:32 AM
User is offline Chris Adams
323 posts
5th Level Poster






Re: Wikipedia needs your help 

@Kimbo - I love reading your answers...you always have so much to offer.  However, on this one I have to side with Sandy.  I believe the intent of the BABOK, while admittedly not stated as clearly as it could be, is NOT to descibe three levels of abstraction within a hierachical set of requirements.  If it were, then I would tend to agree with you. But I don't believe it is.  Sandy's explanation is very well put (using the orange as an analogy).

Also, please don't foget how helpful these conversations are to this community of users.  You can give someone an answer, but that has limited impact.  Other analysts reading this very well thought out exchange, including some important areas of discourse, are exposed to a valuable learning opportunity.  I for one love these types of threads.

@Tony, ...Sandy is correct.  The BABOK describe decomposition.  Unfortunately, I think you probably just did a search on the work partitioning.  While that's a great word an carries importance, very few in the industry use that particular terminology.  Though we know you like it :)

@ Sandy, again very well stated.  I appreciate that you take the time to outline your responses in a way that they are very clearly understood!


Chris Adams
Core Member – ModernAnalyst.com
LinkedIn Profile
 
New Post 2/7/2012 3:06 PM
User is offline Tony Markos
493 posts
5th Level Poster


Re: Wikipedia needs your help 

Sandy:

First of all,  I said the BABOK talks only a little about decompostion - I did not say it said nothing about such. 

You say an enterprise can not be represented by a context diagram/data flow diagrams. Does the BABOK say such?  It is not true.   I am very experienced at using data flow diagrams for enteprise analysis.  What else provides for a litmus test of completedness, logical partitioning to enable deep decompostion to handle complexity, and the ability to handle the non-sequential nature of systems at higher levels of abstraction?  I am very curious as to which modeling techniques you feel or the BABOK says are appropriate for an enterprise analysis.  

Ya DFDs are for solution requirements, but they are for the other two types also.   DFD's capture the highest level behavioral-related goals, down to detailed solution requirements via tight integratio with logicial flow charts.  And they also capture all stakeholder behavioral requirements in the same model. 

Yes, one can model a system from the viewpoint of stakeholders, or limit a model to just the behavior within an automated  solution.  But DFDs can be used for both situations (and enterprise analysis).  And with DFD's there is only one type of behavioral requirement.   And if more than one type is not needed, multiple types are the result of a contrived partitioning.

Tony

 

 
New Post 2/7/2012 4:58 PM
User is offline Kimbo
454 posts
5th Level Poster


Re: Wikipedia needs your help 

Sandy / Chris

Well now... am I correct in thinking that what you call solution requirements are what were once known as "non-functional" requirements? Hope so. Otherwise they look like solution masquerading as requirements. This is a common and continuing problem in BA land. How do you know when you do your requirements gathering if there will even be an IT based solution. Perhaps you mean system in the logical sense?

All the techniques I use as a BA work at all levels of the business including the Enterprise level. Sandy I think you are quite wrong to suggest that an enterprise model can't be represented by a context diagram and / or information flow. Along with other modelling artefacts they can be used very well to represent a business both at the enterprise and sub-enterprise / business area levels. Just as process forms part of my model at the business unit level, so does it also at the enterprise level. In fact I'm doing that right now in my current contract. That is a fundamental thing with good techniques - scalability. Have a read of some Business Architecture books.

Like I said before I haven't read the BABOK and perhaps I shouldn't. Sounds like I"ll just get angry :)

I'm enjoying this chat btw.

Kimbo

 

 
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